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 Avatar: The Last Airbender

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nosaint317
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PostSubject: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 12:19 am

Just finished watching all 3 seasons, and I gotta say, it was pretty good. I can't say I've seen many American action cartoons this good... there just aren't that many, lol

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 12:43 am

Disagree, I thought it was bad. As an American dramatic cartoon it was miles above anything we've seen but still doesn't mean it isn't riddled with plot holes and other problematic things.

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 1:13 am

.....ignore the wanton hipster douche

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 3:13 am

I'm not gonna completely diagree with him proceed, I will agree there are some plot holes(giant unexplained god turtle comes outta nowhere!) but for the most part, the series as a whole is pretty good. And ya gotta take into consideration this show was created with a younger audience in mind(for example, the extreme lack of characters dying even with all this war going on). And ya gotta admit it had some very well animated action scenes too. Some of the battles looked cool as hell. All in all, I give it a good rating. But this is just my opinion, we are all entitled to one ^____^

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 11:24 am

Let me start by saying I never "attack" people who have opinions I disagree with (except Pro), I debate with them.



I understand the "it was made with kids in mind" argument but it also wants people to immerse themselves in this world of people acting in what they believe is the best course of action. Let me just point out a few things that really brought the series down for me:


Aang learns things he never even uses against the Fire Lord (and in some cases, no one at all)- I understand the "learning these things are just so he has better control of his bending" but that also brings me to my next point.

Aang does not need control of his bending to fight the Fire Lord, just to know how to summon it- When he goes into "Full Avatar State" against the FL he doesn't use the stuff he's learned to "control" the elements, the State is doing it for him. This makes all the episodes of him learning to control these things feel like a waste.

The Fire Lord never seems like the threat they make him out to be- Throughout the series you rarely see him doing anything diabolic- It's Azula, It's the Generals/Commanders, It's Zuko.....Not until near the end of the series do you see him doing anything overly evil and the last few episodes are the first time you even see what he's truly capable of. How is the audience supposed to think this guy is an all-powerful monster if you never even see his ability? Everyone is always talking about how hopeless it seems to defeat the FL but we never see any proof of this.

Bending- What the hell? Bending uses the four basic elements but also can control sub-elements that fall under the four basics............So why is this hardly explored? The audience knows bending has been around for hundreds of years but we're supposed to believe that people have never been able to blood, metal, or w/e bend? But Toph can metalbend in a matter of hours along with Katara being able to blood bend by basically knowing the theory of it. This also brings up an interesting point of why were the Airbenders wiped out? Airbenders should be able to take the oxygen away from attackers long enough for them to at least pass out. Even if they're too peaceful for that they can take away the oxygen that's needed for fire. Now that I think about it bending is awful: A Waterbenders can suck a person completely try of their fluid, Airbenders can suffocate people, An Earthbender can cause widespread death through mud/landslides, earthquakes, or sinking an entire continent, and we already know what Firebenders can do. BTW, why can only an Avatar do other forms of bending? Are people born with a lock on their bending based on their parents or something? Maybe I missed this.

Not killing Aang- Why not? They captured him several times so why not kill him? He's the LAST Airbender, no matter what is next they can never be a full Avatar since they can't learn Airbending. Then again, with all the plot devices they shoehorned in I'm sure they'd find a way.

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 5:12 pm

And my opinions:

He did seem to learn a bunch of superfluous skills on his journey, but I think it was partly to give the views a full grasp of what bending skills were capable of. But truthfully, the only side skill he learned and used was the lightning redirect, which he only used to save himself and not strike a critical blow against the overlord(but who didn't see that coming).

Yeah, I liked how they left the Avatar state as what they originally defined it, a defensive technique meant to come in in dire situations. It was good that Aang left the avatar state after nearly killing the FL(since the other avatars' techs and experiences would be influencing him), coming out of it and finishing him with what HE has learned. I'd enjoy that ending a lil more

And YES! THank you. It bugged the hell out of me that they never showed what he was capable of till the final episodes. You only ever hear about what he did to zuko, and his armies do all the work. I would have liked to see him bring down some wrath on someone and see what he's capable of, like a right between him and Iroh where Iroh had to retreat, i mean, if he did that to his own son, imagine what he'd do to an infadel. But then again, children's tv show, they couldn't exactly be too ruthless...

Well, I will defend them with how they BRIEFLY explained the origins of each elemental bending and the animals that were their origins. But I never got how they couldn't figure out these different bendings beforehand. Somebody had to have thought "Well, water is in everything, right?" or that for fire to happen you need air to fuel it, a vacuum would stop a firebender. But there's the whole "Souzen's Comet, MWAHAHAHAHAHA, UNSTOPPABLE!" thing they were pitching the whole time. My thoughts are they were trying to show just how talented the main cast were. They were a gathering of extremely gifted individuals that gathered around the avatar to eventually train him themselves and that most soldiers(cannon fodder) weren't as nearly as gifted as some individuals. And as far as widespread death, I'll say it again, TV-7, lol. Plus if someone did show up and try widespread destruction, another equally or more powerful bender would show up and put a stop to this. Example, the FL at the end, he tried to burn it to the ground, the Avatar said "No", lol

I'm not gonna deny Aang's death as a possible outcome, though I definately saw it as "not very likely". That would disrupt the whole theme of hope the show was going for. No matter how dark things got, there was always a silver lining. And I always wondered if that you had to be born from the airbender tribe or was it something you could just be born with? I guess they were trying to not make the show to complicated. lol

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Sun May 20, 2012 8:38 pm

I loved this series and I'm currently loving Korra, but as to your last point Comp, the reason the fire nation wouldn't kill Aang was so that the Avatar wouldn't be reincarnated as a water bender. Then they would just have to begin their search all over again. I think Zhao mentioned it after Aang was caught by the archers. I believe he said why they were going to keep him alive, if only just.

Bloodbending had most likely been discovered before, but was probably kept a secret. Metal bending on the other hand was discovered by Toph because of her unique way of seeing. She was able to see the minerals of earth in the metal, which nobody else could do unless they learned how to see like she does (such as Aang and her daughter Lin).

All of the main characters in this series were prodigies. If you want examples of main characters who are not prodigies, watch Korra. Bolin and Mako are excellent Pro-Benders, but when it actually comes to fighting they are fairly weak.

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Mon May 21, 2012 1:34 am

I believe what comp was trying to say was, logically, that even if they did kill him and he reincarnated, the next avatar couldn't be as powerful since it would be unable to learn airbending being that the last airbender is now dead. But they did try to kill Aang, the first time he purposely went intot he avatar state, Azul tried to strike him down with lightning, luckily Kitara had the magic water and revived him.

And he's right about Tof, remember when she was locked in the metal casket, she was hitting it, feeling it out like it was earth and then she realized she could bend it, it wasn't perfect at first but she got damn good at it

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Mon May 21, 2012 2:35 am

The only reason they attempted to kill him then was because the avatar does not re-incarnate if they are killed in the avatar state.

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Mon May 21, 2012 2:51 am

Indeed, but the fact inpoint is, they did try to kill him, once. Lol

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Mon May 21, 2012 6:16 pm

nosaint317 wrote:
And my opinions:

He did seem to learn a bunch of superfluous skills on his journey, but I think it was partly to give the views a full grasp of what bending skills were capable of. But truthfully, the only side skill he learned and used was the lightning redirect, which he only used to save himself and not strike a critical blow against the overlord(but who didn't see that coming).

He's not more capable than any of the people that taught him so why was so much time given to establish what he could do? If anything they should've spent more time on his Airbending since he's the only one that can do those things in the show.

Quote :
Yeah, I liked how they left the Avatar state as what they originally defined it, a defensive technique meant to come in in dire situations. It was good that Aang left the avatar state after nearly killing the FL(since the other avatars' techs and experiences would be influencing him), coming out of it and finishing him with what HE has learned. I'd enjoy that ending a lil more

Agreed. His fight with the FL was basically the things he was handed (Full Avatar State, ability to take away his bending) as opposed to using everything he learned.


Quote :
But then again, children's tv show, they couldn't exactly be too ruthless...

We have a show with numerous reference to death (widespread and otherwise), a father that burned part of his son's face off, a general referencing keeping a 12 year old boy fed and watered just enough so that he clings to life, a woman that influences people by literally controlling their blood, and an honest to god deathblow that the Avatar only survived because of healing water. The "Kids TV show" excuse doesn't fly with me.

Quote :
My thoughts are they were trying to show just how talented the main cast were. They were a gathering of extremely gifted individuals that gathered around the avatar to eventually train him themselves and that most soldiers(cannon fodder) weren't as nearly as gifted as some individuals. And as far as widespread death, I'll say it again, TV-7, lol. Plus if someone did show up and try widespread destruction, another equally or more powerful bender would show up and put a stop to this. Example, the FL at the end, he tried to burn it to the ground, the Avatar said "No", lol

I'm gonna point to One Piece for this one: One Piece is centered around a crew with once in a lifetime prodigies in their respective fields. The thing is though, the things they do are hardly "new" or "groundbreaking", it's just that few before them have been able to do the things they do well. Even within that world there are people that do the things they do but much better. Team Avatar seems to literally have the greatest Earthbender of all time, the ONLY Airbender left, a 14 year old with strategies greater than seasoned generals, and one of only 2 people ever able to bloodbend....

The Fire Nation invades the Earth Kingdom, no one stopped that. They overthrown an entire race of people but it's not "overly evil" because there were no casualties......


Quote :
I'm not gonna deny Aang's death as a possible outcome, though I definately saw it as "not very likely". That would disrupt the whole theme of hope the show was going for. No matter how dark things got, there was always a silver lining. And I always wondered if that you had to be born from the airbender tribe or was it something you could just be born with? I guess they were trying to not make the show to complicated. lol


Clearly the main character isn't gonna die most of the time (especially in the beginning of the series), my main problem are the reasons for him not to be killed. In superhero comics, and the like, the villain toys with the Hero to humiliate or hurt them emotionally which usually allows the Hero to escape. In Avatar it's so they "won't have to go looking again" and crap like that despite Azula trying, and almost succeeding, to kill him. BTW, if they had killed Aang and then just used Sozen's comet to become basically the rulers of the World would a new Avatar, one that won't be ready to fight for a least a decade, really be that much of a threat?


MyBrothersACretin wrote:
Bloodbending had most likely been discovered before, but was probably kept a secret. Metal bending on the other hand was discovered by Toph because of her unique way of seeing. She was able to see the minerals of earth in the metal, which nobody else could do unless they learned how to see like she does (such as Aang and her daughter Lin).

Never mentioned before nor since. Bloodbending is a truly terrible prospect but it could be used to have enemies submit without confrontation by merely controlling them to give up their weapons and locking them up afterwards. I refuse to believe that if this was discovered before that there would not be SOME type of seedy areas of Water Tribes that don't know of it.

If the way Toph sees can be so easily taught (Aang learns in weeks) then people who've been practicing Earthbending practically their entire lives should've been able to teach themselves at some point.

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Tue May 22, 2012 12:55 am

I feel like BG goes into shows looking for things to pick out and be mad about haha

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PostSubject: Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender   Tue May 22, 2012 1:01 am

LoneSaiyan115 wrote:
I feel like BG goes into shows looking for things to pick out and be mad about haha



If I did that then I wouldn't be a fan of anything lol. I'd say I tend to break down a series more than I should when people have nothing but praise for it: Dark Knight, Dead Space, Mass Effect, etc..... as people tend to let their fandom get in the way of glaring problems in these things. I am a proverbial wet blanket when it comes to things that are popular but aren't really that good in my opinion.

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